Exculpate the Blaster

Kaji Motomiya wrote:

Yeah, this is TOTALLY the Yu-Gi-Oh! R part of the manga just dicking its way into CFV. Totally, and completely, unnecessary.

You know what, let's skip the Draw Phase! Let there be a card that'll make your opponent skip his/her draw phase! Because CFV is apparently not fucking YGO enough!

shh! bushiroad might hear you! :O

I think there's a bit of an over reaction here.

If this were an actual YGO card, it'd be CB1 for the field attack and Blaster Blade would have an on-ride effect which allowed you to recycle it from the drop zone.

ScarletWeather wrote:

I think there's a bit of an over reaction here.

If this were an actual YGO card, it'd be CB1 for the field attack and Blaster Blade would have an on-ride effect which allowed you to recycle it from the drop zone.

I think the Yugioh reference was to the level of situational that this card is. It's just really convoluted for a relatively straight-forward game that Vanguard is.

3XXXDDD wrote:

ScarletWeather wrote:

I think there's a bit of an over reaction here.

If this were an actual YGO card, it'd be CB1 for the field attack and Blaster Blade would have an on-ride effect which allowed you to recycle it from the drop zone.

I think the Yugioh reference was to the level of situational that this card is. It's just really convoluted for a relatively straight-forward game that Vanguard is.

Poe's law strikes again.

Okay technically not Poe's since I wasn't trying to parody any specific group of people, but it was meant to be a sarcastic barb at how YGO tends to work, not an actual analysis of how convoluted Exculpate is. Because Exculpate is pretty convoluted and about the closest thing we have to a "Nomi" in playable Vanguard, or will ever have for that matter.

Of course, it was quite an accurate description of a Yugioh comparison so you can't blame me for not being able to see the sarcasm.

3XXXDDD wrote:

Of course, it was quite an accurate description of a Yugioh comparison so you can't blame me for not being able to see the sarcasm.

The sad thing about YGO is that it's impossible to parody by excess without your card being printed two months later.

Oh, don't get me started on YGO. I migrated to this game from it die to absolute rage ove rhaving to play absolute morons in the game who though the Deck has to be all staples then about 7 cards that defined your "deck type". It was too easy to get them to ragequit, because they only focused on getting the one play out. Every deck had to have 1 ace combo that the rest of the entire was just dedicated to setting up as fast as possible. If you don't OTK in YGO, it's not a viable deck. That's why I like VG.

VG is chess to YGO's Hungry Hungry Hippos.

Hahahahahahhaha hungry hungry hippos.

Called it. I'm starting to wonder if the Hat-Man was inspired by it given how many folsk independtly came across that conclusion.

Also, this cards is the most insane card ever. I mean, yeah it's YGO, but its like Season One YGO mad. I mean it was made on all the drugs, look at it, souls and drops and rides just moving around everyhwere. What the christ!

It's from the manga, and the mangaka takes direct inspiration from the creator of Yugioh :|

Strictly speaking, the manga-ka was one of the pupils of the creator of Yu-Gi-Oh.

And apparently he did a damn good job as far as storytelling goes in the past. I haven't read it yet but fans of the original YGO manga give Yu-Gi-Oh! R, the spin-off Ito worked on, unreal praise.

And to be fair to the poor guy, Takahashi was not really that interested in designing a game when he built Yu-Gi-Oh- that manga started off as showing off all sorts of different types of games, including a trading card game which he had intended to be sort of like Magic; The Gathering but less complicated. Eventually he began to focus on the game itself. Takahashi apparently used to do a lot of tabletop gaming and not a lot of playing TCGs. It shows. Ito is in pretty much the same boat, as Exculpate is honestly the exception rather than the rule- nearly every other manga-exclusive we've had has been very heavily altered (Imperial Daughter, Promise Daughter) or actually surprisingly good or at least fun to build around (High-Powered Custom Raizer, Deathanchor).

Yeah I know a lot about the original Yu-Gi-Oh! which was supposed to be a literal title. Not "King of Duelmonsters" but "King of GAMES". I've read them countless times and love the games he played before the DM craze. Duelmonsters was pretty cool but let's face it; it was never designed to be balanced. Hell, the original version was made by Bandai (horrifically shit at making card games) and they basically ripped off War by having people take turns comparing ATK vs DEF and sending them to the grave, then add up star values to determine the winner. And it's not like Takahashi understands Game Theory or how to balance games. Like do any of you know why in the game of street dice, 7 is the neutral number? It's because 7 is the most probable result of any given double dice roll. Therefore it's neutral becuase it's neither higher nor lower than the most probable. People who design games have to understand basic principles like this, and the creators of MtG and YGO cards do not understand concepts like this. CFV was doing amazingly well until all these fucking manga cards. These are clearly two different teams designing cards and it shows.

MtG arguably not so much actually. It was the first time anyone had ever designed anything like a trading card game, and the first time anyone had ever conceived of a game where you could essentially have pieces that only one player or both players or some players or any combination of players could have access to and others wouldn't- and what those were could be radically different between games. Given MtG has a lot of strong elements as a top-down game, I think it's done pretty okay for itself even if I don't feel the need to spend money on it.

I wouldn't say that CFV has two different teams though. Comic Style was the one pack where we got a lot of manga cards, and most of them fall into one of three camps:

a) Horrible

(Miss Mist, Cat Butler, Left and Right Arrestor)

Most of these were heavily altered from manga appearance, or just sucked there and thus got carried over to the actual game pretty much intact.

b) Really good

(Promise Daughter)

c) Just quirky

(Pretty much the brunt of that set)

A lot of really cool cards came out of Comic Style- Guard Gryphon, ZANBAKU, the Raizer series and Promise Daughter come to mind. No-Life King Death Anchor was a promo I believe, but he's a really fun Dark Irregular to include in builds (and the only effectively 11k unit to have a main phase soul charge upkeep skill, and the only card with that to not have a megablast). The manga cards are weird as hell and a lot of them are borderline unplayable, but they're a lot of fun for casual builds and new support has proved that some of them even make for surprisingly formidable and interesting decks. I don't think Ito's the one dictating which get printed or designed in the end- Bushi's just consciously screening and letting through manga cards that they think will be fun and have a big impact without being broken as hell.

Seriously what the hell manga Promise Daughter.

(Oh, almost forgot- Machining, arguably the strongest Megacolony variant, debuted in Comic Style as well).

I'm not giving MTG a free pass on criticism simply because it was the first. Too many people do that and that's why I'm so loud about its faults. Of which there are countless numbers.

Alice wrote:

I'm not giving MTG a free pass on criticism simply because it was the first. Too many people do that and that's why I'm so loud about its faults. Of which there are countless numbers.

I don't give it a free pass, I just think it's worth noting. The game has a lot of structural weaknesses, but a many of them flow from the things which make it a strong game in the first place. I actually don't have a problem with Magic's mechanics as a general rule, I just think it's a bad game to follow because the same things which make it interesting to learn about make it nearly impossible to finance as a hobby. It's also still got general balance issues all over the place.

As a game though? It's actually pretty well set up, and has a lot of interesting concepts.

Vanguard has overall stronger mechanics as a TCG intended to focus on fantasy army combat, and it's also just kinder to your wallet as a general rule. That's why I play it.

EDIT: Since this is moving off-topic, if we want to continue why don't we just head here, where where it isn't?

I'm editing the goddamn name of this thread. I keep making spelling mistakes because of it.

Frankly, the only good WOTC games are those made by Mike Elliot.

Which ones are those? Inb4 Duel Masters.

Pokemon, Harry Potter and MTG are bad.

Battle Spirits (though the gem stem is clunky to physically use irl) Kaikudo and DM (aka mth done right) and a whole score of innovative tcga and ccgs that never made it past a few years because Wotc is the game company equivalent to Fox.

Alice wrote:

Which ones are those? Inb4 Duel Masters.

Pokemon, Harry Potter and MTG are bad.

Wizards didn't make Pokemon. They might have made a few cards for it though and there was an issue of them not wanting a set to be released in English because they were afraid it was going to break the game which I believe is one major reason for Nintendo taking it back.

Except they did. Wizards is the Publisher of record for the Pokemon TCG in the USA from 1998-2003 and was designed with the same patented systems that Wizards uses in magic and harry potter.

Except Pokemon was originally published in Japan 2 years previous by Media Factory. WOTC Published it sure but I doubt they designed it considering it existed 2 years previous before they ever laid their hands on it.

Unless MF & WotC are related somehow.

No one talked about who DESIGNED the game. SK said Wizard games. I simply listed games that WOTC has published that sucked. By the way, Mike Elliott was the designer of Harry Potter. And the original Pokemon TCG was, I believe designed by Creatures/GameFreak with endorsement by Nintendo and simply published by Media Factory in JPN. Since no one is talking about design, Wizards is being called out as the publisher of that awful game. If you do want to talk about design, look at how much the Pokemon game did actually resemble other Wizards games. Some after the fact like Harry Potter and some before like Magic.

In addition, check WOTC's records for Mike Elliott's work. He's listed as the Project Leader for Pokemon TCG from 2000-2001, so he is partly responsible for Wizards' failure of a game. His other failures include design nightmares like Neopets, Star Wars TCG (the one with Character/Space/Ground arenas), Netrunner (fun but poor design), Simpsons, and Harry goddamn Potter. I don't know how much he had to do with these abominations, but if he had very little to do with them and a lot to do with DM and CFV, then I can understand. But so far his track record really smells like "Biological Scientist" than card designer savant.

Ah. Misunderstanding cleared.

English ver. confirmed to be included in a box of EB01.