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 BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed

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Traesive

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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-23, 14:20

So Sealed Dragons not only blow shit up like regular Kagero units, they fuck of columns.
Then Blockade murders the field.
Welp.

And Narukami is getting so interesting gimmicks. Nice to see a Dragon Empire clan getting some soul related effects.
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LittleFighterFox

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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-23, 14:33

Ignoring Crossride and break rides.
Kagero
- Unrestricted retirement. I like that.
- Blockade is quite with Corduroy and Terrycloth by almost sealing any good columns. If there are more like this then I can make one.
- Kersey is hilarious.
AquaForce
- Genobios is rediculous. I takes Naval Gazer and removes the necessity of Daimantes/Bethaniel and a fourth attack and needing to HIT, with only a persona blast more. (for use in a 4th rear-guard deck obviously)
- 2 or less RG skills can also be used twice.
Narukami
- have no clue
Angel Feathers
- Pheonix is Meh. I like Shamsiel and Metatron more. It does the unflip and power boost like Shamsiel but losses out on hand movement and defensive numbers.
- Actually, AF skill in this set look meh. The art is another story.
Tachikaze
- Erghh....Ancient Dragons.
- Drive check cool but is defeated by consistent LB4:+5000 cards. Got antoher skill because of that though.
- Skyptero "subclan" clone is good.
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HugeMcLargeTall

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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-23, 14:37

my Tachikase boner is at critical mass!
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3XXXDDD
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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-23, 15:34

Oh Shuki is a Grade 1, not a Grade 3.
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3XXXDDD
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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-23, 16:06

http://blog-imgs-51.fc2.com/2/c/r/2critical/v1364039180.jpg

Pointed out to me

> Text of Phoenix doesn't have Limit Break
> The Page, which seems to about nothing other than Phoenix, has the Limit Break 4 slapped all over it.

One of those have to be wrong.
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Donkay

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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-23, 20:33

3XXXDDD wrote:
http://blog-imgs-51.fc2.com/2/c/r/2critical/v1364039180.jpg

Pointed out to me

> Text of Phoenix doesn't have Limit Break
> The Page, which seems to about nothing other than Phoenix, has the Limit Break 4 slapped all over it.

One of those have to be wrong.

Please no limit break.
Please no limit break.
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3XXXDDD
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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-23, 22:41

Solidify Celestial, Zerachiel
Grade 3/11000
LB4: If there is a face up "Solidify Celestial, Zerachiel" in your damage zone, all your "Celestial" units gain +3000
(Assume Lord?)

Sariel
Grade 2/8000
AUTO: [Counterblast 1] When this unit is placed on Rear-guard Circle, if you have an «Angel Feather» vanguard,
you may pay the cost. If you do, choose a «Angel Feather» from your deck and put it in your Damage Zone, then place one unit from the Damage Zone to the Drop Zone.

Underlay Celestial, Hessiel
Grade 1/6000
Auto: If there is a face up "Solidify Celestial, Zerachiel" in your damage zone, this unit gets Power +3000.

From tonight's episode. Amazing cards, Sariel is beautiful ;_;. Zerachiel is batshit insane. Hessiel just adding an additional 9000 booster to the roster though (though Pegasus doesn't seem as consistent here) although not like that's necessary considering Zerachiel already making Trigger become 8000 Boosters, Grade 1s would then be 9000 MINIMUM. 13000 Max. Grade 3's being Palamedes.


Last edited by 3XXXDDD on 2013-03-23, 23:04; edited 2 times in total
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Noy620

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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-23, 22:51

3D, I think Sariel is a 9k
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3XXXDDD
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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-23, 22:53

Noy620 wrote:
3D, I think Sariel is a 9k

No It's 8000 I'm sure just like Love Machine Gun, Dancing Princess of the Night Sky, Hi Dog Breeder Akane, Darkness Maiden Macha, Beast Knight Garmore, Free Traveler. You get the idea.
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Noy620

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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-23, 23:05

I saw her go 12k during LB, then again, it is the anime.
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3XXXDDD
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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-23, 23:21

> Play Shamsiel
> Play Sariel
> Place Perfect Guard

YOU KNOW WHERE THIS IS GOING.
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3XXXDDD
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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-23, 23:21

Noy620 wrote:
I saw her go 12k during LB, then again, it is the anime.

You sure you aren't getting confused with Hessedial who was 6000 -> 9000 -> 12000?
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3XXXDDD
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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-23, 23:26

Quote :
http://blog-imgs-51.fc2.com/2/c/r/2critical/zCjju1Na87GbHVi1364040130_1364040135.jpg
Eradicator, Sweep Command Dragon
Grade 3/Narukami/
Auto (V) LB4: [CB2/SB2] When a card is sent from the Rearguard to Drop Zone, can pay the cost. If you do, select 1 of your opponent's front row Rearguards, retire it, and during this turn, this Unit gains 5000 Power.
Auto [Target 1 Eradicator Rearguard of yours, place it in your soul] When this Unit appears in the Vanguard Circle, you can pay the cost. If you do, select 1 of your opponent's

Apparently you also draw one card from the Limit Break too.
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Edalborez

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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-23, 23:28

Sariel is the blonde with the candle. She went to 11k during the power-up cut-ins.
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Alice
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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-23, 23:44

Terricross - That is some broken BS. Probably will still use Conroe because ultrabroke but 1:1 in most cases since top 4 won't always have a g2. Even then, it'll likely just get strictly raped by the rest of the deck.

Corduroy - I'm seeing a cheating theme here.

>They're all fabrics
WAT

Calze is a REALLY nice cycler.

Genobios - THIS is what AQ LBs should be like. None of that hit bullshit. This is going to be rip-roaring bullshit awesome in a 4ths deck

Oh shit nigger the new ride chain is really good actually. I need to run numbers on this type.

Even though it's technically broken, I will love running mass production sailors in an AQ rush deck. Likely with the starter that boosts for 8k and likely with the vanillas and Eugenes. I have a sneaking suspicion why this card was made: Kidani-san (CEO of Bushiroad)'s favorite deck was Aqua Force and he really loved Durandal's Manguard decklist in L.A. This clearly facilitates easy rushing.

Tyrano: Shitty Descendant PBD clone. Fucking stop giving retire costs to PBD effects. It's shitty and fails massively.

Spino Driver is pretty interesting. At first appears to just be Ashley with a forced cycle skill. In actuality it's TWO things: It's an Ashley with an Ildona, except the Ildona cost can be recouped for CB:1 each. Therefore it's usually CB:2 +2 (+4 to hand specifically), and +2 stages and +1 critical. That's pretty badass.

Dinocloud can be easily CB:1 for a 14k attacker. Not bad. Like a slightly more expensive and setup reliant Brakki. But without a minus

Iguano Corg is straight up broken as fuck. Amazing <3

Gattling Arrow is basically Reckless Express for CB:1, except relies on setup of stuff like Skyptero. And no minus~

Ancient Dragon, Baby Rex - This card makes Tyrano Legend not complete dogshit. It's actually a great skill and hope to see more like it. Though not sure yet if I'd run this over Dragon Egg (with one Tyrano tech) or if I'd just use Dragon Egg.

Battle Rex is kind of shittacular. The problem I see with this is FORCING a retire so it eats up CB in midgame whether you want it or not. What is unfortunate is that it only gives itself the 2 stages. There's no use for that during midgame and no guarantee you'll get the skill in late game. Pretty terrible ass card, do not run. Deathrex is honestly better because you get the extra stage guaranteed.

Armor Break Dragon - So fucktarded niggers translated this wrong at first. ANYWAY. Shitty ass Vermillion, would not run without extremely compelling support. Fuck off paying CB:3 for a simplifier. The rest of the skill does basically nothing in late game unless you're a damage eater.

>That Phoenix - wat da fuq. I do not understand. So LB unflip each turn for some power? Okay, I think I still like Shamsiel more. *Update: if it's not LB, then this is pretty nice. Unflip each turn of midgame guaranteed.

Mammoth will be good for TK. They needed an unflipper.

Sweep Command is interesting. NK seems to be going for a lot more simplifiers. They may be the first clan ever that can meaningfully simplify Vanguard. They'll at least play a quality control game which I'll have fun writing about.

First Thunder Dracokid is a neat skill. The top ten search will likely be fruitful enough to warrant the minus chance. Best used during BATTLE so you can recoup the minus and possibly plus.

Penuel is neat for being able to get pesky checked stuff out of the damage, but what's really interesting is she unflips. Still a minus though.

Raiou - Hoping NK get a proper soul engine. Pls

Zerachiel - WAT? WAT WAT WAT WAT WAT???? Holy fucking SHIT! TURBO SEPHIROT! Jesus fucktwatting christ on a cracker

Sariel is a BROKEN ass reverse-LMG Nociel. This one searching Zerachiel or even PGs to set up for getting to your hand or getting turboSephirot live. God DAMN Angel Feather. It even recoups the counterblast.

Hessiel - Oh come the fuck on. 9k booster. And that's before Zerachiel is on (V) to make it a 12k booster. What. The. Dick.


Last edited by Alice on 2013-03-23, 23:52; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : fuckshitting ape twats stop mistranslating shit you niggers)
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3XXXDDD
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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-23, 23:57

Penul is actually 1 for 1. Penul goes in soul, you play a card from damage to field. I'd probably still play Turiel though for more flexibility especially considering Sariel is now a thing.
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Alice
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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-24, 01:48

3XXXDDD wrote:
Penul is actually 1 for 1. Penul goes in soul, you play a card from damage to field. I'd probably still play Turiel though for more flexibility especially considering Sariel is now a thing.
Fucksake, I missed that. Oh well. I'd rather have the unit that can change itself into shit I set up in my damage zone than some -1 unit that might help with a job the rest of my deck already does. Penul > Turiel. Suck it Turi-fags.
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Lich_Lord_Fortissimo

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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-24, 06:38

Well, I think I can safely say that this will be the only Set where I am motivated to buy a ton of boxes.
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3XXXDDD
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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-24, 06:47

Alice wrote:
3XXXDDD wrote:
Penul is actually 1 for 1. Penul goes in soul, you play a card from damage to field. I'd probably still play Turiel though for more flexibility especially considering Sariel is now a thing.
Fucksake, I missed that. Oh well. I'd rather have the unit that can change itself into shit I set up in my damage zone than some -1 unit that might help with a job the rest of my deck already does. Penul > Turiel. Suck it Turi-fags.

If running Celestial that is (I think it only superiors Celestial?)

Turiel does add to the hand which can be useful with those Sariel.

Neither is strictly better as far as I can tell as of yet.
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YAMIshin

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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-24, 08:11

Damn those angels... make me drolling non-stop since I watched the anime.

anyway, Sariel can also be used as deck thinning. no longer need copies of metatron at deck? summon and fetch metatron, then dump her to drop zone.
then kick Sariel off with metatron's LB, re-summon her and dump another one. Unlike other deck-thinning, those 2 combination might really thin the decks a lot.
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Alice
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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-24, 09:07

If you say the word Deck Thinning you best show step by step how to achieve at least 13 thins before late game.
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YAMIshin

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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-24, 11:29

I will just say it in front that it will be impossible to thin 13 cards by late game in actual match.
The game probably end before you can thin 13 cards, although if some strange thing happen and both player suddenly stop attacking each other, in paper that combo can dish out all your non-trigger cards endlessly. It's just... the method will take some turn and vanguard is fast-paced (trivia: last week in Japan, BS is seems to about to apply a rule that if a game not ended after 20mins, both player will be declared as lose, instead of looking at the most damage, damage change procedure, etc)



And, I'll just put the method here, even if shaving 13 cards is still out of reach *in normal games*

First, this method abuse Sariel CIP and Metatron ability to re-summon making CIP effect usable again. A combination that is still exclusive to Angel Feather as for now (Sakuya and Lena by some extent can be used to re-use CIP effect, but you have just so many copies of them in deck, making them inferior to Metatron)
Second, this will use Metatron LB, so shaving cards pre-late game is out of its capability.

condition:
- 4 unflipped damage.
- Metatron as VG.
- Sariel in hand.
- 1 random card in hand or field

Turn 1:
1. summon Sariel. Eff: CB1, put Sariel from deck to damage. send 1 damage other than Sariel to drop zone. === total: 1 card thinned ===
2. Metatron LB. Eff: CB 1, put Sariel and 1 random card to damage then re-summon 2 Sariel.
3. Use both Sariel eff: CB 2, put 2 random G3 to damage and send 2 damage to drop zone. === total: 3 cards thinned ===
*at this point, if you discard 2 flipped damage using Sariel, you only use total 2 CB*

Turn 2, if your opponent left your Sariel untouched:
4. Metatron LB: CB1, put 2 Sariel and re-summon them.
5. 2 Sariel eff : put another 1 random G3 and Nociel (love machine gun) then send 2 damage to drop zone. === total: 5 cards thinned ===
*since you resolve 1 Sariel eff per go, you only need 1 open CB for those 2 Sariel eff. off course if you drop the flipped damage*

Turn 3, once again if those Sariel is untouched:
6. Metatron LB: CB1, put 2 Sariel to damage and summon 1 Sariel, 1 Nociel
7. Resolve Nociel first for refresh, since your 4 open damage is all flipped down by now.
8 resolve Sariel eff. === total: 6 cards thinned ===

Turn 4, if Sariel still intact:
9. Metatron LB: put Nociel and Sariel to damage zone, re-summon 2 Sariel
10. resolve 2 Sariel eff. === total: 8 cards thinned ===
11. rinse and repeat from move #6 for unlimited thinning. (3 cards per 2 turn)

Not impossible to pull, but I don't think both player can survive for that long in late game. Especially if the Angel Feather player has full pegassi in their back row. The 23/28/23 line is kinda hard to block even by crossride. Plus, any sane player won't let your Nociel *and now Sariel also* survive for so long in the field if you have Metatron as VG backed by those pegassi.

Lastly, the popular build of Metatron in Japanese tourney environment is 4 G3(Metatron) using full chain ride or 6 G3(4 Metatron + 2 Calamity Flame) with thermometer angel as starter.
So although it is impossible to make the deck significantly check more trigger in timely manner, you can dish out those 3 unneeded "shield-less" Metatron (and Calamity Flame if you have Million Ray Pegasus ready) from your deck. which is good since differences in 5000 shield might help you in tight spot.

So, I don't say that this is a perfect form of deck-thinning but a sort of way not to draw shield-less G3.

And for math sake * I hope I'm not wrong*:

turn 1 (deck left 37; trigger left: 13):
- prob of single trigger check (w/o thinning): 58,6%
- prob of single trigger check (w/ thinning, total 3 cards): 62,5%

turn 2 (deck left 34; trigger left: 11): *let say I draw a trigger on my draw*
- prob of single trigger check (w/o thinning): 54,9%
- prob of single trigger check (w/ thinning, total 5 cards): 62,3%

turn 3 (deck left 31; trigger left: 10): *let say I draw a non-trigger on my draw this time*
- prob of single trigger check (w/o thinning): 54,8%
- prob of single trigger check (w/ thinning, total 6 cards): 65%

turn 4 (deck left 28; trigger left: 8): *let say I draw a trigger on my draw*
- prob of single trigger check (w/o thinning): 49.7%
- prob of single trigger check (w/ thinning, total 8 cards): 65%

Still not so significant, but in Angel Feather bringing those cards are not hurting the deck itself because they can damage swap *as well powering-up pegassi* and at some extend reliable to dish out the unneeded G3 from decks.







ps: I somehow doubt that Sariel can put flipped damage to drop zone. So if it turns out that way, then we can change the method a bit which is a bit slower

turn 1 (open CB: 4)
(open CB: 3)Sariel fetch Nociel to damage (deck thinning total: 1)
(open CB: 2)Metatron => re-summon Sariel and Nociel
(open CB: 2) Sariel fetch another Sariel to damage, Nociel refresh (deck thinning total: 2==)
turn 2
(open CB: 1) Metatron => re-summon Sariel and Nociel
(open CB: 1) Sariel fetch Nociel to damage, Nociel Refresh (== deck thinning total: 3 ==)
turn 3
(open CB: 0) Metatron => re-summon 2 Nociel
(open CB: 2) 2 Nociel Refresh (== deck thinning total: 3)
turn 4:
(open CB: 1) Metatron => re-summon Sariel and Nociel
(open CB: 1) Sariel fetch random card, Nociel Refresh (== deck thinning total: 4 ==)
rinse and repeat from turn 2 for a random card thinning per 2 turn
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Shadowbane

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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-24, 12:36

If you are going for something like that,the Neo Nectar Musketeers can do a better job of deck thinning then any deck.
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TehNACHO

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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-24, 14:38

Compression.

Musketeers succeed because they thin the deck with all their calling, then fatten the deck with units[intercepts] they want to have in the late game.
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Lich_Lord_Fortissimo

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PostSubject: Re: BT-11 Seal Dragons Unleashed   2013-03-24, 14:49

A particularly interesting card for the new Eradicators caught my eye: http://cardfight.wikia.com/wiki/Iron_Blood_Eradicator,_Shuki


Now, coupled with a card like this, Eradicators could reasonably hit 18k+ while not going Vanilla. Especially since cards like this can still kill things without cutting into valuable Counterblast on 1:1 basis. http://cardfight.wikia.com/wiki/Devil_Blade_Eradicator,_Chouou

And then there was also that Sephirot Steroid Angel Feather card.

So I was thinking: Yeah, I know that still does kind of mean that you need to run that specific build in order to not die too horribly, but as far as I can tell they could still operate on numbers and bring their strategy to the table at the same time, so the decks are far from just boring vanilla. SO, would it be worth it to swap from a Crossride deck (a boring one like PBO or a one-time thing like E.I Pacifica, I certainly wouldn't run this lot over Ji Endo just yet) for something like this?

The boss cards are static 11k, so the 20k columns that the top-tier and archtype based cards operate on wouldn't cause too much worry.

I was just wondering if this was Bushiroad's plan all along or I'm reading into this WAY too much.

Thoughts?
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